Ellie & Moses debate tonight

As far as I know, tonight's Chamber of Commerce/EmPOWERment/League of Women Voters event at Chapel Hill Town Hall is the only chance to see Senator Ellie Kinnaird and her challenger Commissioner Moses Carey in a direct dialog before their primary contest. I'd like to tell you more about the event, but only the LWV web site even lists it on their calendar, and they offer less info than the Chamber's press release (which is posted here).

Apparently it will also be broadcast on WCHL 1360 AM (live?) so if you can't make it tune in there and watch this space for updates from yours truly, who is bringing her laptop.

(PS: This and other items from our calendar are now listed under Upcoming events at the bottom of every page on OP.)

Corrected at 5:05pm 4/9/08.


I previously posted the release here on OP and it's here on the Chamber site.

It is suppose to be broadcasted live on WCHL and on cable Channel 18.

If you followed my links you'd see they pointed to the event you posted here on OP. You must have superior web finding skills to mine as I looked all over and couldn't find that info on the Chamber site.

Anyway, duly corrected. Thanks.

Ellie and Moses are introducing themselves. Also at the table are representatives from the Carrboro Citizen, the Chapel Hill Herald, the Chapel Hill News, the Daily Tar Heel, and WCHL.

Ellie emphasizes her accomplishments in passing legislation on mqany issues of interest to us. Moses spoke to his own experience and relationships needed to get things done.

First question, from Kirk Ross of the Carrboro Citizen: What would be your top priorities should you be elected?

Ellie: Fix the disastrous mental health care reform. Local control.

Moses: Access to health care, including mental health. Water conservation.

Ellie: Also supports health care acess. Support Rep. Verla Insko's bill making health care a right. Also drought response.

Moses: Also energy conservation. NC population is aging, need to plan for how to address their needs.


Neil Offen, CH Herald: Sen. Kinnaird was recently ranked the 27th most effective legislator by the NC Ctr for Pub Policy research. Would you be more effective/are you effective?

Moses: I would be more effective, especially in health care.

Ellie: I am effective. Orange is a progressive Co, it expects leaders to take on tough issues. These aren't easy to win on, but they matter to people in this district.

Moses: I started the debate over Orange County having a social justice goal. I'm the only one who supprted merger. Not afraid to take tough principled stands.

Ellie: I have learned how to work with the legislature. I've been called the conscience of the senate. The leadership respects my role there. I have accomplished a lot on those principled issues.

Meiling Arounnarath, CH News: Ellie has said she wants her succeeded by a woman in her Senate seat. How is a female legislator different from a male legislator?

Ellie: Women work differently. The women's caucus is bipartisan. Look at budget differently. I'm co-chair of justice & public safety, with 2 women we are working more on prevention and intervention instead of building prisons. There are the same number of women in the senate as when I started (7).

Moses: Need a rich, diverse culture in the legislature, including women and African Americans. There are 70 women running for the legislature across the state right now, so there's no lack of women to serve. Don't want to turn the clock back on civil rights.


Daily Tarheel: What is your strategy for combating illegal immigration, how involved should local law enforcement be?

Moses: This is a federal issue. In Orange Co we work with the Sherrif to make sure he doesn't arrest people just for being undocumented.  Many of these folks are performing important work in our community. I don't think we should send them all back home.

Ellie: We can't live without the work of immigrants. I am against the state taking away drivers lisences from illegal immigrants. This was political, but makes us less safe.

WCHL: How should the state handle repeat offenders?

Ellie: The governmental systems don't talk to each other, need better information. Not enough programs to help with drug addiction, mental health, and other problems.

Moses: Do need to improve management and provide better services. Related to the mental health debacle. Prevention.

(By the way - there are about 50 people here, and the forum is being moderated by the general manager of WCHL. He has been asking some conservative-seeming follow-up questions, like "are you concerned with seeming soft on crime?")

Carrboro Citizen: State employees took a big hit to balance the budget, what can be done to give state workers a fair shake?

Moses: We should not begin to retrench on health insurance costs by increasing deductables, that's short sighted. State needs have the guts to raise revenue. Need to think more long term about investing in our future. We can save money by providing better care for the elderly.

Ellie: State employees should be allowed to bargain collectively although they can't strike. Need to put employees first instead of last in the budget system. Retirees are costing the state more, people can't afford their dependent insurance. Asked Sen. Rand to advocate for bulk rate pharmaceuticals, which saved the state money. Rep. Insko has a bill for this.

C H Herald: What and the NCGA do to fcreate more affordable housing?

Ellie: Trying to poass inclusionary zoning, which would require a certain amount of affordable homes in each new development. Proud to have cosponsored a bill with Sen. Rand that will change campaign donations, which will increase support for affordable housing.

Moses: Increase funding for the Affordable Housing Trust Fund. This will be supported by having more voter-owned elections.

Interesting that both turned this question about affordable housing into a campaign finance issue. I guess that speaks to the power of the real estate lobby.

Audience questions up next after this quick commercial break. 

Not audiece questions, actually, more media.

Meiling, CH News: ill the Triangle ever get a mroe commuter-friendy public transit system?

Moses: Yes, but the state and federal gov't need to help more We wait until it hurts. We're getting there eventually.  We have to take the initiative, not wait for Congress, like on issues like universal health care.

Ellie: 90% comes from fed gov't so the best way to get rail is to elect a Democratic congress. The new regional plan serves Chapel Hill and the aiport, this is an improvement. We have the best bus system in the US, but bus schedule is responsive to students not workers.

Elizabeth _?_,  DTH: What sets you apart from each other?

Moses: I am the only candidate who has 24 years of government experience, 18 years of business experience.  Lived through creating easements to protect Orange Co farmers.  I have the ability to buold alliances and convince peopel to listen to me. Have developed relationships with legislators across the state, esp in public health.

Ellie: I have a respected record of accomplishments that I can carry forward. Has formed coalitions with the leadership & membership of the Senate.  Has made a difference and will continue to make a difference.  Part of a strong progressive coliation in the Senate.

Even on this, they say almost the same thing! 

Yes, the reporter from WCHL (Natasha something?) just asked a question about what the state should do about sex trafficking. (Me: HOW IS THIS RELEVANT TO OUR DISTRICT? Who is this person?)

Ellie: It should be called "human trafficking" and it happens everywhere, even NC. Passed a bill to give services to victims. More funding for training programs and services to victims.

Moses: This is a problem, the state can help by working with local officials. Just as with mental health debacle - state needs to recognize the importance of local services.

Audience: Will you introduce (and vote for) legilation to compel merger of the 2 school systems?

Moses: I started the merger debate in 2002 b/c I thought it was a social justice issue. And I think it's the responsibility of local government to address this inequity. In Raleigh I would oppose any attempt to merge schools from the state level, however.

Ellie: The Orange County delegation (with Insko & Hackney) has fought this off every year. There are 2 segregated school systems in the state, this is what ppl in Raleigh wanted to address. The situation in Orange is not the same. we do have make sure both systems are funded fairly.

They agree. 

Audience: what will you do to increase the commercial tax base in Orange County?

Ellie: Fighting corporate incentives. Revamp the tax structure.  Water & sewer bond funds go to poorer communities.

Moses: The Board of Commisioners have created and supported economic development districts.  Would also support funding infrastrucure for local governments.

Audience: How would a constitutional amendment guaranteeing health care for all be implemented?

Moses: This would ensure that the government covers everyone instead of the perverse incentives we have now.

Ellie: Money spent on emergency care now would cover primary care for all.


Natasha Vukelic is the WCHL News Director.

The recent UNC Cconference (Sally Greene was a panalist): Combating Sex Trafficking: Prevention and Intervention in North Carolina and Worldwide said that it's a growing problem.

Elizabeth DeOrnellas is The Daily Tar Heel representative (and State and National Desk editor)

Why did the DTH reporter ask about illegal immigration? 

Also, it's so nice to have choices like these in an election. 

there were no questions on solid waste issues.

Here is some video of the debate that Mark Peters put up on Google Video.
Pete MacDowell has studied the legislature longer and more closely than just about anyone in our district. Today, he circulated the following via email: As a long time observer of the legislature and the campaign finance system, and as one who has supported Ellie and followed her career from her first election to the Senate, I personally have the greatest admiration for her integrity and courage in deciding that her job is to represent her principles and her constituents and the best interests of the people of the state first and foremost. She is certainly among the smartest and hardest working people in the legislature, is as friendly and gracious as anyone could wish, and can be a pragmatic coalition builder - but she refuses to be a team player when the team is playing the wrong game. She speaks truth to power when necessary, and that is not always a way to win favor with the powerful. In the process she has won the reputation of being the "Conscience of the Senate" - and that body has often sorely needed that conscience and certainly does not always listen to her. The Senate is a very conservative pro-business lobby chamber. Frankly, I don't know how she finds the gumption to put up with it, but she does, and I don't know how anyone with her progressive politics and her moral principles could do a better job for us. We are very lucky to have her.
In an earlier discussion here, David Richter stated that "those like Moses Carey believe that they can run for office and the public will not care about this issue."

And there was a discussion in which Neloa Jones, wrote that "Our favorite people will be there: County Commissioner Moses Carey and Solid Waste Director Gayle Wilson." and added that "As a Rogers Road resident new to local government task forces, it quickly became clear to me that Moses Carey expected the members of this task force to "yes" all the issues put before them. I suppose I shouldn't be surprised since "yes-sing" the county's agenda (and fabricating reports) is what happens at SWAB
meetings. Hey! Not on this task force . . . "

Moses Carey

1) Pushed to rush through the transfer station decision without any site search.

2) He displayed disdainful negative body language when Valerie Foushee requested a delay in the siting vote because she asked for time to vet the selection process. That is when he said "all roads lead to Eubanks".

3) He read Chilton's letter of opposition to the siting of the transfer station again with obvious disdain and disrespect.

4) He started the mitigation task force by warning the Rogers Road community that they would have to be prepared to be responsible for getting each government to fund or approve any improvements to the neighborhood. The BOCC had no money or authority.

5) In the 8/07 meeting of the task force he misled (euphemism for lied to) the CHN reporter by telling her that the board had considered many sites before choosing Eubanks.

6) In a follow-up meeting he distributed the minutes of the last task force meeting after having already placed it in the BOCC record. No one on the task force besides Carey and Wilson had reviewed the minutes.

7) Tried to block Neloa Jones from presenting to the all governments meeting. Only when it became clear that all the other attendees wanted to hear what Neloa had to say, did Mr. Carey relent.

Moses Carey has both integrity and arrogance problems and should not be elected to any office much less the State Senate. Hopefully Senator Ellie Kinnaird will be reelected and Moses Carey will be completely retired from elected office.

Not surprising given her leadership and effectiveness as an environmental  leader in the Legislature.

 She is Vice-Chair of the Senate Agriculture, Environment & Natural Resources Committee and also serves on the State Energy Policy Council.

  • Ellie introduced a moratorium and tough new regulations on hog waste lagoons.
  • Ellie led the legislative effort to stop the southeastern states from dumping their nuclear waste in Chatham county.
  • Ellie banned construction materials in landfills.
  • Ellie established a farm use tax status to help farmers remain viable and protect the land on which we depend for our food and for our future.
  • Ellie established standards for energy and water conservation in state buildings and required that the state minimize use of paper.
  • Ellie passed the bill to require the use of alternate fuels in the state vehicle fleets.
  • Another positive note - Bernadette Pelissier was also endorsed by the Sierra Club, which is no surprise given her lifetime commitment and activism on environmental issues. The good news for Orange County is that the Board of Commissioners will get a huge upgrade in environmental expertise and advocacy with the departure of Moses Carey and the likely election of Bernadette.

    I'm waiting for the Jon G. Bass debate between either Moses or Ellie.  I'm sure many of you already know who I'm rooting for.
    Hmm... Despite being one of those crazy Carrboro hippy liberals, Ellie Kinnaird had the highest margin of victory of any senator in a contested race in the entire state in 2006. My guess is that either she or Moses would continue the trend of getting three-quarters of the vote in the general election.
    There is no doubt in my mind that Ellie would probably win the nomination. But I still have hope that us few conservatives (fiscal not social) can still have a voice in Carrboro politics.

    Having a *voice* in local politics is about conversations. Starting off a conversation with attack videos isn't such a good way to get people to listen to you. Leann's youtube page: http://www.youtube.com/user/rightgrrl

    Or slogans like "Antagonizing the left"... how about "disagreeing with the left" or "Challenging the left?" :)

    Buckhorn developers contributions to Carey's campaign 

    George Horton $250
    Roger Perry $1000
    Rosemary Waldorf $250

    I support Ellie, but to say those contributions were "payback" to Moses for Buckhorn Village, as if these three people had swooped in from out of town and given Moses money only because of Buckhorn Village is very unfair to him and them.



    that it's incorrect to consider these contributions any sort of direct payback. It's surely more of a birds-of-a-feather phenomenon. Perry and Waldorf (I don't know Horton as well) are pretty consistent in supporting candidates with a particular approach to growth.

    I would be the first to admit that my own contributors last fall were also birds-of-a-feather although of a very different feather than Moses' (for example, I don't think I had a single contributor whose job was listed as "investor"; Moses has many).

    If, as scientists recently claimed, birds are descendants of dinosaurs, then the Tyrannosaurus Rex of  the North Carolina corporatocracy making a donation to Carey's campaign is surely noteworthy.

     Duke Energy  $2000



    Community Guidelines

    By using this site, you agree to our community guidelines. Inappropriate or disruptive behavior will result in moderation or eviction.


    Content license

    By contributing to OrangePolitics, you agree to license your contributions under a Creative Commons Attribution-NoDerivs 3.0 United States License.

    Creative Commons License

    Zircon - This is a contributing Drupal Theme
    Design by WeebPal.